... definitely not today.
I can't do anything in the Ubuntu wiki (bug report) ... yeah Konqueror is only default browser on Kubuntu, why would we do QA for it
I just learned that when you install the java plugin it will pull in firefox, which will pull in ubufox, which will pull in synaptic, which will pull in half the main archive.
And why do you think is that?
Depends: libasound2, libx11-6, libxext6, libxi6, libxp6, libxtst6, sun-java6-bin (= 6-07-4ubuntu2), firefox | firefox-2 | iceweasel | mozilla-firefox | iceape-browser | mozilla-browser | epiphany-gecko | epiphany-webkit | epiphany-browser | galeon | midbrowser | xulrunnerNotice anything?
Now I am feeling rather stupid because I actually started work on ubuntu-kde-default-settings making KDE 4 apps look like native Ubuntu/GNOME ones, too bad I don't feel like continuing it :-(
:-)
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23 Comments:
Kubuntu users do get ignored a lot and it has some to do with the name as well.
Just install the openjdk java, konqueror doesn't need any special plugin.
This is very simple to fix. Move to another distro :-). These days, even Fedora is more KDE friendly. But this plugin packaging is very strange: why would java depend on Firefox? Or any browser? In gentoo, when I set a "plugin" USE clause in java, it just build the plugin and put it on a shared plugin folder.
Best regards,
Laerte.
That's too bad.
You found a bug, ass-umed it was discrimination, and dropped your work. Normal people file a bug report and get on with it.
@vadim: I don't think he assumed it as "discrimination" but instead that it was a lack of attention/thought to provide an option for Konqueror.
Either way, it is causing some major issues, whether on purpose ("discrimination") or not and as such should be fixed.
The last one actually makes sense: the java plugin IS for mozilla, not for konqueror. Konqueror uses the java executable directly for applets. So if you ask it to install a plugin for firefox, you cannot really complain if it thinks you want to install firefox :)
That said, kubuntu OUGHT to make that a package SUGGESTION, not a dependency because there are plenty of plugins out there where konqueror DOES use the same plugins as firefox so to make them depend on firefox when you allready have konqueror is silly.
Better yet, depend on service "webbrowser" which both konqueror and firefox can provide.
You are right though, kubuntu is not nearly as polished as ubuntu and receives a lot less attention - which is why I am down to only one kubuntu install (the one that's hardest to replace).
Since Fedora is much more innovative these days and it's more focussed about freedom I'm so sad to see Ubuntu always just looking for "more market share".
I switched to debian exactly for this kind of problems happening too often in Kubuntu. The overall quality just feels quite a bit worse than in other distros IMOHO.
A QA team would be a good idea, yes.
You can, with the same reasoning as OP's post, switch to Windows.
It has tons more support after all, right?
@vadi
Windows is not a distribution that actually ships Java or KDE :) So your analogy seems to be totally off.
No, but it is an OS where everybody has tons more support for you!
So, the analogy is right, because it's an analogy, not a direct example.
@vadi: I fail to see the analogy as well.
@sin, silentcoder: I didn't know that, thanks for the information, I'll fix kubuntu-restricted-extras dependency on sun-java6-plugin once GCC is unbroken :)
Switching to openjdk is worth a thought as well, I'll bring it up at the next meeting.
@laerte: Well, even if the maintainers of the package in Ubuntu think it is a good idea to depend on $browser they might really do $browser (i.e. depend on www-browser which is a "Provides" tag of all web browsers in debian/ubuntu, rather than listing them manually)
@laerte, diego: Fedora is really heading into a very awesome direction, switching however would be a kind of workaround... I don't really like workarounds ;-)
@vadim: yes, if it was like one of these things happen once a year... otherwise go with greg's interpretation :)
@thomas: We are aware of this issue, in fact the Kubuntu Ninja team, which is fighting for better KDE packages at release time, spends a lot of their time on QA before releasing the packages. The overall problem however is that there are too few people to do QA.
Way to get all worked up over a packaging bug.
If you notice the ";)" at the end of the post, then you'd know he didn't really mean it.
The java package problem is only worthwhile if it's needed. the plugin isn't needed, since Konqueror can run the executable itself. If the java package is being pulled in by something else (kubuntu-restricted-extras, maybe?), then it really is a problem. I agree that using the browser metapackage would be better, though.
The screenshot looks cool though, love QGtkStyle! With a bit more work, different TKs will only be a matter of APIs (gtk-qt-engine and QGtkStyle) ;).
Unfortunately gtk-qt-engines is lacking quality. Also rendering Qt UIs in GTK using QGTKStyle works a lot better than vice versa using gtk-qt-engines. :|
Knowing this guy and other hardcore KDE people, I think the smiley was there to simply cut flak.
Yes, it'a nice to see that Qt finally delivered the promised Linux integration it has been missing for over half of the Linux desktops.
True, good thing GTK still didn't manage to *applaud*
Small difference, Qt is a commercial platform that's sold on cross-platformity.
GTK isn't.
I'm having a feeling that you were a bit more serious about this bug report however =)
Qt is free software, just like GTK, the only difference is that Qt development is driven by a company.
And I don't really see how that justifies Qt/KDE people write a GTK->Qt AND a Qt->GTK engine.
@apachelogger: I agree that QGtkStyle looks better that gtk-qt-engine, and that gtk-qt-engine was made by KDE people and QGtkStyle was TT. I also know that Gtk emulates native widgets in non-gtk desktops (KDE, Windows, Mac) whereas Qt (as of sometime in Qt4) can actually use native widgets.
In other words, yes gtk-qt-engine could use some improvements (Gtk needs some improvements?), but we're closer than we were before.
We definitely are, and I get pretty excited about the fact that slowly everything is coming together (i.e. one unique appearance of Linux applications, no matter on which desktop).
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